Choosy riders choose...

This thread is a lot like this one:

http://www.imtbtrails.com/forum/threads/5-star-products.3446/

 

I think he was typing after drinking at least a 6 pack.

 

Golly.

 

Non sibi, sed dei.

Sive cervisiam.

 

Nostalgia: A few years ago I would have included these as a required MUST. I put these on each bike I had. DH, AM, XC. my how things have changed. In parenthesis the current status

1. SDG Bel Air saddle with I-Beam post(dated saddle shape, my beloved I-beam posts only live in the DJ world now)
2. Thompson x4 elite 50mm long. ( got tired of cracking faceplates, switched to PRO XCR 60mm for forged alloy XC light DH tuff. now plenty of good forged alloy options.)
3. XT cranks(still great value/performance. but RF forged alloy and others competing at price and more current designs)
4. Oury lock ones(Still running these, but see the benefits of newer designs that have softer ends. I may switch)
5. Mavic UST 819, 823 rims(Mavic did not keep up. To narrow for today's performance. New enduro models announced, yummy)
6. Addidas hematoma shoes, on Time clipless pedals(addidas DH shoes dissappeared after 2010ish. I still like Time clipless but used flats right now.)

 

imtbtrails converted me from White Lightening to Rock and Roll Gold. Heck I didn't even know they made other versions.

In fact it was a post @Varaxis loaded that was a Shoot Out as to which chain lube produced the least drag. If I recall, RnR Gold was the best and White lightening was the worse, so I switched.

 

Yes, but like movies, there are often remakes.

 

With how long lasting modern lubes last, you don't need to lube until you hear your chain being loud and/or squeaky and, considering the typical climate of SoCal, should be merely wiping off the chain after rides. For light lubes like WD40* and ProLink, lubing after every ride is a good routine.

Gold is heavily PTFE (teflon) based, which is a dry lube in the sense that it works as a solid film as opposed to being an oil. Other dry lubricants are paraffin wax, graphite, and molybdenite (MoS2, which is what's used in Kashima Coat and Fox Gold 20wt). With the Gold formula, it's carried to the inside of the chain with a solvent. Extreme (Blue) is more oil based, which is more useful for its ability to stick to surfaces and relies on oil's nature of repelling water. Absolute Dry also relies on Teflon for lubrication, but in a lower concentration.

Friction in a scientific sense is caused by the electrostatic attraction of atoms. Stickiness is useful for not being flung away from a moving object like a chain, or ball bearings, or a sliding shaft inside a suspension fork. The Gold formula pretty much targets the electrostatic nature of friction by making nothing else stick to it. Not even sure why AD is still around with Gold, since I imagine Gold takes what they learned from AD and amped it up--the price difference isn't that much.

Oil comes in various thicknesses, viscosity, which changes at various temperatures. The thinner it is, the more runny it tends to be, and the better suited it is to get between tight spaces like dynamic seals for sliding surfaces, piston cylinders, or chain link/bushings of high tolerance chains (10+ speed bicycle chains). Blue is on the thicker side, which isn't so good for friction, but good for its ability to stay put longer. Like many other chemical products, the formula of RnR extreme might have changed over time (certain brands of sealant are notorious for changing formula over time), so I can't be 100% sure it hasn't been improved to be more like Gold and AD, but its original intent was to protect the chain from splashes from puddles and what not, which can allow grit suspended in the water to make it on to the chain if it weren't for the oil's ability to repel water, hence the difference between wet and dry lubes. Not to imply that dry can't handle the wet conditions and it's common for lube formulas to have a combination of many different lubricating compounds (oil+teflon+wax)...

* WD40 was a product ahead of its time, seriously speaking here. Being a cleaner and lube in one is now a concept that has caught on, which a lot of popular lubes mimic these days (just more expensive, due to higher quality lubricant). For the price, WD40 can simply be used for its solvent (mineral spirits) in a cost effective manner, which makes up over 90% of its concentration, but I digress.

Fun fact: RockShox's "Fast black" coating found on their forks and dropper is infused with dry lubricant. The lubricant isn't permanent though, and it does pretty much turn into just a black surface after normal use. Other brands know this, and instead just invest in things that can be replaced, knowing that the treatments aren't permanent, like higher performance wiper seals perhaps infused with dry lubricant, which should be replaced regularly to maintain high performance levels. Kashima coat is a much more durable coating that has a much stronger bond between the base metal with its solid lubricant. The bigger the stanchion diameter, the more surface area has to slide past seals and bushings, and the more effective the coating is. I believe they offer it for a dropper, despite its smaller diameter, because there's no bath oil in the dropper. Factory 32 and 34 forks have performance benefits besides the Kashima coat; mostly lacking all the cost cutting on parts inside that slightly compromise performance, that OEMs request in order to reach price points with a healthy margin, all adding up.

Also, LMAO at that 5-star thread. Talks about cups and and Mikie comes in and goes, "What the HALE is going on here!?"

 

Hey Mr. Science Guy - How do you obtain a rolling resistance measurement? I've never seen that measurement before, and it could come in quite handy.

Side note: According to Maxxis website, the 27.5 x 2.30 3c/Exo/TR version of the DHR-II is only 19 grams lighter than the DHF - same version. I had to convert to grams from lbs! I don't know if that qualifies as significantly lighter, but after your magic cuts, it most certainly is. That rolling resistance number has me scratching my bald head though! I can feel that the HR-II is slower, but man, I am skeptical that the DHf is about the same in RR. It feels much faster than the HR-II to me, and very similar to the DHR-II.

 

German mtb mags just pretty much borrow Schwalbe's test lab and run their own tests and publish them. There's also the infamous Zedler test over there (most dropper posts fail it, besides Fox & Vecnum, but GD made a valiant stand), which was created by one of the mag testers. Those Germans and their engineering habits... love it. Too bad they're not like Santa Cruz Bicycles, who use unyielding concrete and steel for their test rigs. Instead, these Germans use flexy extruded alloy rigs.

This is a common one I see posted up on various other mtb forums. I can believe these values based on my riding experiences and impressions:

Rollwiderstand - coefficient of rolling resistance (textured drum roller test)
Durchschlag - resistance to pinch flats (anvil drop test)
Durchstitch - resistance to punctures (weighted needle test)
Gewitch - weight

(yes, they use commas instead of decimal points. TSC is TrailStar Compound, PSC is Pacestar, SG is SuperGravity casing. No clue which version they used for the Conti tires)






Another go-to product of mine:

King Cage stainless steel bottle cage - doesn't eject any of my bottles. Not sure which is a bigger deal, the material used, or the geometry, but together they work. Stainless is heavier than alloy, CF, and plastic, but F that stuff if it fails to work.



Honorable mention to Lezyne Flow Side loading composite cage.

award goes to:
- Bontrager RLX carbon cage = broken from normal use. A Camelbak podium wasn't a great fit in it
- Cheap 4/5mm alloy cages = ejects bottles
- Cheap 2 piece cages (alloy rails bonded to composite base) = bond failed

*looks over chart again* Ardent 2.6... the original 2.6 tire, eh? What's old is new again? Also can see that weight differences are relatively proportional to pinch/puncture resistance, so being lightweight isn't so ideal if you're sensitive to those things

BTW, the HR2 speeds up once it wears down a bit. Take a look at the above pic for an example. I will agree that it's pretty damn slow feeling, even compared to a DHF, but I suspect that's because they use a slower rebounding construction, which helps make it more stable and grip as well as it does.

 

I actually don't really have a brand preference for PB. I just like crunchy, though I keep trying to give creamy a try every once in a while. Whatever happens to be on sale... speaking of which...

My go-to stores for groceries:
Food4Less - dozen large Grade A eggs for $1 or less, 6oz bags of pasta for 5/$1, yuge cans of pinto beans $1, sardines sometimes for $1/16 oz
99c Only - Sara Lee & Nature's Own 20-24oz 100% whole wheat bread for $1, some really hot deals every so often, like Oscar Meyer 14 oz smoke sausage for 50c, 30 oz Kraft Mayo for $1 (great butter substitute, such as with mac n cheese or baked stuff), can always find good not-so-sugary cereal for less than 10c/oz, plus they carry my fav flavor of pasta sauce Hunt's Zesty and Spicy

 

Shoes (clipless), I am a Shimano guy.

And I agree about the King bottle cages (I use the titanium version). I have two on my TJ. Weight weenie light, too.

 

Egad, what people put into PB and into their bodies is downright frightening. Brown spackle posing as PB – no thanks. Good PB is not cheap, but there is no alternative. On tour occasionally I'm forced to consume the spackle. First thing I get to a decent store, that shît is in the trash.

 

@Varaxis .... it's good to have you back!

 

Thanks for the detailed reply! Since Gold is a dry lube, would I expect to have less dust sticking to the chain than I do now using Blue lube? That is really my only complaint about the Blue.

 

These are my must haves:

Saddles have to be WTB.....for me they just work. Silverado and/or Volt

Chains....KMC. I have broken less of these while getting more mileage than SRAM or Shimano

Pedals....Shimano SPD's. Been running them since 1996 and they plain just work.

Tires....Maxxis. Like the offerings they have. Like the sidewall protection and the ease of Tubeless.

Hubs....DT Swiss are the go to. Last forever. Adaptable to all the different standards.

Bikes....Santa Cruz. Quality of bikes. Quality of the ride. Best warranty in the business. Best customer service in the business. Threaded BB's. No ebikes.

 

To keep it simple, if your goal is to ride without needing to work on your chain as frequently, like being able to take off the rear wheel (ex. to fix a flat), fix a dropped chain, or stick your hand in the area at all, perhaps to pull out some weeds without getting covered in grease, and want it working quiet, slick, and smooth, and happen to ride in conditions that aren't splashing slop up at your bike, then I highly recommend RnR Gold.

You really don't need to know all the geeky details--just say that you want specific results better than whatever you're used, and that's enough. Hopefully someone knowledgeable will recommend specific products, rather than mere features to look for in products. You use RnR Blue, and want less dust build-up... yep, no further questions needed, you should switch. Hand off that Blue to some poor unware rider that's using even worse lube.

I will say that it's not just because it's a dry formula, it's because they paid attention to ionization, static, etc. and paid attention to the chemical make-up to ensure stable compounds (ex. don't get dissolved in water and break down to form new compounds), paid attention to what has free flowing electrons (ex. metals) and taking advantage of that fact to stick to the chain and not minerals (ex. sand and other grit), and purpose-made the lube to handle being exposed to normal riding conditions. Again, do not expect the same results from other dry lubes. It's just not that simple. I can't say really much more for certain, because I'm not a chemist nor know what's exactly in RnR Gold besides looking up its MSDS a while ago.

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Srirachi Chili Sauce - spicy hot tangy goodness that is light and consistent enough to use like ketchup. Goes on anything you might season at the table. I combine it with lemon juice for fish, as an alternative to salt, pepper, etc. Replaces salt and pepper for eggs. Heck, replaces soy sauce too. Get flavor without all the sodium. Get the real stuff, not the imitations. I get it at Winco for about $4 for a 28oz, which is super fair price for what goes into it.

 

My drivetrain prefers something a little spicier. I use Tabasco on my chains.

 

Dried tabasco pepper ground to dust, plus salt, suspended in vinegar. That watery and gritty consistency will help it get in there and rust it. Oh wait, those red-orange specs are just the sauce doing its thing, just like you'd see when you wipe your lips with a napkin.

 

That's when you know it's ready to eat.

 

The only thing that I have had on all bikes is grip-shift. Back in the day it even said grip-shift in bold print. Then GS Attack. Now XO. F-brake on the right or I won't play and look like avatar guy. WD-40 on chain & pivots, (not bearings). Foam grips, any cheap brand. That's all I got!

 

Is it safe to say that Rockshox coating is just TYPE II ano with teflon impregnation?
and that Kashima is Type III ano?
or is there rally more to the finish processes on forks?

 

They're both Type III ano. The black dye fills the pores created by anodization on the black coatings, while they're filled with MoS2 through the Kashima Coating process. Teflon needs a primer to stick to bare aluminum, and they're just sprayed on--sprays penetrate the pores only partially. It's a surface treatment, not a deep down treatment like Kashima coating. Kashima coating can fail if the oxide layer created from the anodizing process just isn't deep enough--it ideally should be type III anodized.

This gives me an idea... perhaps DVO can come up with a Sapphire or Ruby coat, considering they're a type of aluminum oxide and can be lab made. If they figure that Sh!t out, I'm going to ask them to start turning carbon into diamond and lead into gold next...

 

Oh thanks. So I researched Kashima a bit. I had no idea that was a real specified coating name. Figured it was Fox marketing lingo.