Pandora's box is opening. E-bikes

Why do you guys assume it'll be lazy, fat people?? What if it's people w arthritis, cancer or such??

Story: Moose aka Brad Russmesen became paralyzed after crashing at SS. The dude is in PT and is walking and riding again! But what if he couldn't? Should we deny him the joy of riding his ebike on the trails??

Story #2: I saw this huge guy, I mean huge guy, riding his bike at SS. The guy ripped!! Maybe we should ban him from riding trails bc he's too big and is ruining the trails w his weight?!?

Laws will always be voted in, people will sue blah blah blah.

I'm all for Capitalism: Go ebikes!!

 

That's exactly why I included the second half of my take on it. The part where an adult is responsible for his own actions and consequences thereof. As Strand noted it would take a complete overhaul of the tort system in the US and education out of the victim mentality.

It could be done. Not easily and not overnight.

Please let me be on that jury.

 

Well said, Mikie

 

Easy to say when you are young and strong. Being well into my 60's I can see needing some help to get to those places that I may never get to under my own power again. I guess I just might as well start hiking now.

Dean

 

In reply to Story #1.....while it is/was a sad situation.....if he diesnt have the strength to pedal himself on the trails....how is he supposed to handle that beast of a bike in trail. Now I know he is an experienced rider, so it may not be that bad for him.

However, we all know that riders like him are the minority...that many will be inexperienced/unskilled.

 

By modification.

And read Steppies comment, that is what I mean. To me, our view on ebikes are no better than the Sierra Club IMHO.

 

@ridinrox ,
I only mentioned "fat" because Dean brought it up, and since I was fat, and out of shape, and doing drugs when I was introduced to Mountain Biking I feel free reign to constructively criticize on those subjects.
I'm not concerned about fat, large, skinny, arthritic, or cancered, etc. etc. etc.

I'm concerned about our position with other user groups. I'm concerned with those that would never consider riding a mountain bike because it is just too much of a physical "hassle" and now they have a lame excuse called an Ebike to go out on our trails with neither the skills nor the "mentality" it takes to "be" a mountain biker.

Did anyone notice that rossage did NOT sue anyone for dropping off the side of the trail? You know why? He is a man of character. He understands that he is responsible for his actions.

When you make something "easier" you get a wider spectrum of people. Within that spectrum are people that don't belong there. I mentioned this before and hopefully it lands here...

...Look at any parking lot that has easy access to the mountains that is close to LA. Littered with trash, everything taggable is spray painted. Short trails just outside LA. Large boulders tagged, trash lying around. Why? No effort to get there.
But! You drive to Mt. Whitney, long road climb up to the portal, out of the way, not easy access. Low and behold, no trash, no spray paint. You get on the trail. It's clean, no tagging on rocks. Why? NOT easy to get to.

Make our trails more accessible and you get a lower level of character. I believe for the most part that real Mountain Bikers have character.

We have to learn from our past and be wise with our future. Learn from our mistakes. It's more important in regards to right and wrong then peoples feelings. We gotta take the emotion out of this. Including me...

Edit/Note: Let's remember to "LIKE" each other through these posts. Everybody has a valuable opinion regardless of different view point!

 

I applaud your passion and position just as I hope you respect mine my dear man.

True character comes from the individual such as Ross and not bc he's a mtber. I wouldn't have sued either.

I will hold strong on my opinion even if it's the only one. I don't need validation from anyone - I stay true to my convictions.

 

I wouldn't sue because it was my own damn fault!

I didn't make my comment as a rant against the obese and infirm. I just wanted to point out that some of the people who ride these electric motor bikes know that they "should not be here." Those were his exact words. If you know you shouldn't be there-why are you there? He was there using a motor. Motorized vehicles are (for now) prohibited on our local trails.

I do not like electric motor bikes. I have worked on them in the shops. Most are not very well put together. They are difficult to work on as most shop mechanics do not do electrical trouble shooting. Several had melted, fire-damaged batteries. The companies I worked with had shoddy customer service and some never returned phone calls or emails regarding warranty service.
Most of the people I dealt with regarding electric motor bikes had a misconception about what it is to be a cyclist. Instead of riding and training to achieve a goal, let's just put a motor on it and be done with it. "Those guys killing themselves riding uphill are stupid!"-real quote.

I do not like electric motor bikes and I do not want them on non-motorized trails.

 

And w that the novelty will die...end of problem.

 

BING-O!
And "those" are the people that are going to lose YOUR trail rights for YOU...

 

F'ing Biff.....

 

You are also a real mountain biker....

 

I am not going to go all "Appeal to authority" one of the oldest logic crutches in the book. But I have spent considerable time and professional effort on laws and their unintended consequences.Every Law that is passed has to be viewed through the lens of the lowest common denominator... How can it be abused? Because it WILL be! That is where the trouble with every "well intended" law lies. That was the advice that I always gave legislators and committees in drafting and was often times unheeded. I could point to hundreds nay thousands of laws and the gross unintended consequences resulting therefrom because the drafters did not account for how the least among us would abuse them.

You would have to look long and hard to find a bigger proponent of capitalism than this guy… In fact, I can show you the house that Ayn Rand used to party at in the 40's in Laguna. I am all for e-bikes, just not on non-motor trails. The issue is one of an asset that is already been socialized, public land. We can argue about whether socializing the land was a good thing, but that horse is out of the barn.

 

I was going to write a long paragraph but Mikie, Rossage, Leper, and others summed up my views so eloquently Ill just say I completely agree. I will add, We gotta draw the line somewhere. Sierra club thinks the line should be between on foot, and any mechanical conveyance, human or motor powered. (and for very pristine places like the high sierras, i kinda agree). MTB'ers believe the line should be between human-powered and motor-powered, which I think is a more sensible distinction. The line between "2-wheeled vehicles within a certain weight class powered by a certain kind of motor, and other vehicles in a different weight class with possibly different number of wheels powerd by maybe different kind of motor" gets pretty dang blurry, and theres lots of opportunity for deception; and for incorrect but politically powerful generalizations by opponents of all bikes/vehicles.
Selfish point here, part of the allure of mtbing and hiking for me (and for many, i think) besides the exercise and thrill is to get away from all the machines and noise of daily life, get deep into the wilderness (or close approximation thereof)and just enjoy the peace and quiet (something sorely missing from our lives) or sounds of the wildlife or, possibly, Mike singing a tune while hes pedaling up a steep incline as if his lungs have nothing better to do. Do ebikes make noise? If they do and if that gets popular, well that would just be annoying. Caveat: I suspect most ebikes will be piloted by weekend warriors, I ride on weds so ill never see 'em.
I have no problem with ebikes existing but they need to be categorized correctly as motor vehicles.

Interesting that " The local authority or governing body of a public agency having jurisdiction over a bicycle path or trail, equestrian trail, or hiking or recreational trail, may prohibit, by ordinance, the operation of a class 1 or class 2 electric bicycle on that path or trail."
Does anyone know if the county is going to allow them in the county parks? Since this is a state law, how does it affect national forest trails? since local authorities still have jurisdiction in this matter we could be worried about nothing. Its possible this bill was written mostly to make sure class 3 ebikes (basically mopeds) are excluded from all trails..but the op's point that nobody at the trailhead will be checking is a strong one.

 

Wait till there are complaints around "E-bikes" whizzing around bike trails on a 50 pound bicycle @ 28 miles an hour and hit a mom pushing a stroller and they get injured by this person who is just balls out with no regard to anyone. Now let's talk about the roadies, do you think they are going to put up with this...

 

Am I the only one who finds it easier to ride a bike than hike? If so, it may be because I have a severe foot and ankle injury that has left me with chronic pain and inability to jump, run, or hike for distance. I mean, if my disability was so bad that I could not walk at all or make the pedals go round and round, I'm thinking I really shouldn't be out on the trails. I mean, what happens when you loose your balance and fall over? then what? help! I have fallen and I can't get up and I'm in the middle of no where? Mountain biking takes way more physical fitness than just some assist motor to help make you spin faster or easier. Using the disabled reason for E-bikes on trails doesn't make any since to me. If you don't have the power to make it up the hill, stick to some easier trails. Sorry, but not sorry. I have the same lack of empathy that previously large people who have lost weight have towards ebikes. I deal with extreme pain when I ride and major issues trying to HAB. If you are worse then me then maybe you shouldn't be out mountain biking. Speaking of HAB, what happens when a "disabled" rider who needs a E-bike comes to a section of trail they can not clean and they have to HAB a 50+ lbs bike up some steep chunk?

If we have to have this, maybe I could maybe see it on easier trails. I think the option I would like to see is maybe a special handicap placard that E-bike riders need to hang on the bike. Just like a handicap parking plate. Wait. Nope, never mind. Because the easier trails will have lots of hikers and E-bikes will be going to fast and the Sh!t is going to hit the fan.

Yep. pandora's box. the evil ebikes are going to spill out and ruin it all for us all.

 

Ok, let's put away the pitchforks and let the bonfire burn down. Looks like we're safe for now.....

https://www.imba.com/blog/supporter/california-electric-mountain-bike-law

I still don't like 'em!

 

Damn. I was looking forward to storming the castle. I'll keep it sharpened, just in case.

 

Well me too. hmmm the wording use of "trails" is not really defined in that email
but I'm still on guard!
Now funny thing is, I bet you could go and ride an E-bike at aliso woods and get away with it anyhow. Really, who is going to stop and check you? I wonder how many laps up and down you could get before the battery goes dead. hmmmm....

 

First e-bike I see on the FLoop the nukes go off....

 

E-motor bike spotted on Floop. DEFCON 1 status. Call Putin first so this doesn't get out of hand!

 

Thankfully, I've only seen one of the contraptions in O'Neill. A really large guy chugging up Live Oak. It took me 6 months to be able to clear it on my own consistently. I think I got the better end of the deal in the long run.

The only other one I've seen while riding was in the Tour de Palm Springs... I dropped my own kid so I could pass that guy! I admit it... That rabbit pissed me off.

 

What the...???? An e-bike on the TdPS??

That's just weak.

 

If you are disabled to any degree, you should not be on a E bike out in the middle of know where. Stick to paved bike trails and everyone should be happy.

It is just a wait and see thing I guess. Those things are pricey and not really seeing people coming in and asking for one. Our shop has only sold them for commuters and DUI offenders.

 

The Defcon 1 is not an Ebike!

 

You guys make me laugh, bunch of Chx Lil's: The sky is falling the sky is falling ...

I'm more concerned about ISIS than ebikes taking over.

 

ISIS on e-bikes. Handlebar-mounted machine guns, with their 100 lb ammunition belts, IUDs, etc. The battery won't last 10 minutes and they'd be sitting ducks.

Sorry, not really trying to make light of ISIS. But the mental image was hilarious.

 

What was really hilarious, was ISIS brandishing IUDs!

"Do not reproduce... in the name of ALLAH!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Brilliant RwS!! I was hoping someone would take the humor and run w it!! Bravo my man......