Aliso-Wood and Laguna Coast Wilderness Parks

It is seriously bullsh*t. However — and to his credit — that dude is putting up a fight. He made a website & created a Facebook page. He is trying to rally people to his cause. What are we doing? Who is stepping up to try and stop or confront eBike riders? It seems like we are just hoping the parks will take care of it.

For my part, I almost always call out eBikers on trails they are not allowed on, and if we happen to cross paths on Strava flyby, I put a message on their ride. I usually just mention that their bikes are not allowed, and I try very hard to not be a dick or bully about it ... but that really depends on their response to me. Most seem to be unaware, or make that claim anyway. If they are on trails where they are allowed, like SkyPark, I do not say anything unless they are riding like a fool.

There were a few interesting, and maybe even disturbing, posts last night in the eBike thread on Facebook. One comparing "us" to the hostility of hikers towards mountain bikers in the 90's ... one who said he witnessed an eBike rider getting bullied by two guys at the water tower in Whiting ... one chick with a sore knee that hurt her on climbs, so she got an eBike and an ADA permit ... and on an on.

I don't know, maybe we should be doing something to try and stop or at least educate them. I posted a thread on here almost three years ago after I encountered my very first eBike, asking if the damn things should be banned before they got out of hand, and the general consensus was no, because that was a slippery slope towards banning us all ... https://www.imtbtrails.com/forum/threads/thoughts-on-electrics-ban-or-no.3083/ Kind of funny to read some of the responses to that thread again three years later:

"Hmm never seen an electric Mtn. Bike"

"I don't believe there will be an abundance of them on the trail."

"I wouldn't worry about it. I bet that guy ain't coming back. IF he does, he'll likely come back on a regular bike."

"Nah. Just another etiquette issue, but banning anybody is asking to be banned ourselves."

Three years later, and they are everywhere. I can't remember the last ride I did where I did not see at least one ... and it is just going to get worse. The batteries will get smaller and smaller, and pretty soon they will be virtually indistinguishable from our bikes. So, through our own inaction, we may all get banned in the end.

 

I'll admit it. In the beginning I thought guys like @Mikie and @mtnbikej were being kind of militant about their opposition, and way over the top... My position has evolved since then, which makes me sound like a politician. I have not had many positive interactions with them, and we're getting buzzed by more and more when we ride the parks- sometimes on trails that a normal bike would not usually climb. We exceed the speed limit on our regular bikes. No denying it. Those things, however, could easily exceed the speed limit if it were double the 10 mph limit on flat ground or a climb. And they do! It's nuts that their speed is so unnatural and easily distinguishable from a real bike. Add to that the clueless riders we've encountered... My favorite is still the guy I saw in Caspers who came out of an unauthorized trail in Coto. He passed me while yelling that he had "no f@cking clue where he was or what he was doing." No helmet, no water, flip flops... And probably 20+ mph up and down on a $10,000 Specialized. I've seen several like that... Even at the peak.

On the other hand... People who are truly mobility impaired, like the gentleman we met in Wrightwood, have the right to an accommodation. People who are only "mobility impaired" when they want to get to Rock-it? No. They are full of Sh!t.

 

...and as you will recall, MY response was:
https://www.imtbtrails.com/forum/threads/thoughts-on-electrics-ban-or-no.3083/#post-26472">Thoughts on electrics? Ban or no?

My take on E-Bikes is still very clear. This is my "Impact" Study:

I took the time to Photoshop up this pic. Even has the original imtb logo.
I have never waivered on my eBike position.

 

The dominant worldview of our age makes ebikes not just inevitable, it makes them mandatory.

The doctor says that an injection of 250 watts into my bottom bracket will cure my enduro dysphoria.

Our little access issues are nothing in the big picture. The “I deserve to live a life according to my definition of reality” mentality is waaay bigger than a few jerks with $6000 to blow on a moped.

 

So nice that this thread isn’t about me now! Anyways sorry for the delay in responses to anyone on here. I’ve actually been in Canada shredding my brains out. Are there e bikes out here? Maybe, but there are so many trails, so much open land that I rarely run into anyone while riding! From XC tech to double black gnar the hardest part of the day is pretty much figuring out what you want to ride that day. Plus everyone rides out here...and I mean everyone!

 

Interesting story, I was riding el moro a few weeks ago and saw 2 young'uns riding pedegos around. They were contemplating lizards based on the trail maps. I politely told them to stay on the main trail since the bikes had no suspension and were on street tires. I have a feeling these types of situations will be far more common. Especially if those rental ebikes will start to be more popular around laguna.

 

I took a VERY similar survey on mtbr a couple of months ago. I feel like both they and "Bike" are trying to judge the advertising pros and cons, and nothing more.

On the subject of eBike advertising, did anyone see this full on advertisement for the Erions and their eBike shop in the OC Register?

https://www.ocregister.com/2018/09/...n-heat-up-over-e-bike-riders-on-local-trails/

What a sad piece of "journalism." Oddly enough, I did a group ride with Craig Erion a few years back, before he started shilling eBikes, and I remember him as a VERY strong rider ... as in no need to turn to the dark side other than $$$.

Anyway, they both illegally rode Oaks this morning, according to my Strava flyby. I do not recall seeing them ... but perhaps it is time to go aggressive. Earlier this evening, I left a one star Yelp review on their shop, which took only about 20 minutes to get a response from Monica. That response was immediately followed up by two brand new reviews on the same day (09/23) as mine (nothing unusual about that ... except the fact that they have only have 6 reviews ever ... half of which came today? So weird.). Their other two review are December 20 & 21 2017 ... no coincidence there either.

With OC Parks finally banning eBikes and issuing tickets, now might be the time to fight back ... leave a review. Let's bury these shops. As I have said before, I am doing everything I can do to hold up my end. Who else is going to step up outside of our forums?

https://www.yelp.com/biz/evelopros-santa-ana

 

They have been flaunting it for years. They opened up shop after they knew that they weren’t allowed in OC Oarks.

Yeah, I found the article be be a fluff piece for them.

 

I had to look up just how fast a galloping kudu was. 43 MPH... Thanks, @DavidWhiting! That's just what I want to run into out there, as I'm struggling to hit 4 MPH on a climb.

 

The CEO of Pedego is getting into it in the comments section with real bikers... Most of his posts seem to mention the benefits on legal paths. He knows damn well that's not his target market.

 

My guess: Whiting is a hiker who wants all the bikes out.

Whiting used to frequent the local forums to promote his articles, maybe he’ll chime in here?

 

Founder of Two Brothers Racing - 1985
Founder of OCRider.com - 2004
Co-Founder RokForm - 2011
Founder of eVeloPros.com - 2017

Yes... THAT Two Brothers Racing - accessories for sporting motorcycles, ATV's and road bikes. Just sayin'...

Funny that they have a link to Over the Hump on their web site. I didn't know they allowed eBikes on that race

 

You can count on me.
Every time someone posts up a YouTube video, an article, or a survey... I make comments or take the survey on every one of them. I have written David Wiens, Executive Director of IMBA several times. He has responded once.

If I'm not mistaken Chis Conroy, president of Yeti Cycles is/was Chairman of the Board. Now for me THAT... is a real disappointment for me if he had anything to do with the Wilderness BS that IMBA back peddled on...

I just don't think we have the representation we need to get through this. I also do not think that as mountain bikers we step up enough to get through this. That includes me.

 

Rokform was a sponsor for OTH.

OTH had 1 ebike race, but since the course is partial on OC Parks land....no go.

 

He's a member of imtbtrails. He's been here. PM him and it will send him an email...

 

I searched for his user name when I commented above, but couldn't find it... I remember him chiming in on something a couple years ago.

 

I believe Dave Whiting was contacted to do that article.

 

His Screen Name is surprisingly : @David Whiting

 

Well Apparently I can not read the article as it keeps wanting me to register.
Why don't we summons @David Whiting himself?

 

I sent an invite to @David Whiting to stop by and say hello. I told him I can not guarantee it will be civil. But I would hope you guys can contain yourselves and represent the way you should represent.

Mikie

 

Maybe @David Whiting can read my other thread about damage on Harding Truck Trail due to the fires... and the need for some single track biking / hiking trails north of Santiago that don't get bulldozed with each fire

 

Not sure where to start, but I'll raise the bar and let you know I'm seriously thinking about writing a column suggesting new practices on OC trails. OK, I already have. But now perhaps we need to change regulations. No mountain bikes in Aliso Woods and Whiting Ranch on certain trails during certain hours, no hiking on certain trails during certain hours. Too many total idiots flying out of control. And you know I'm right, right?

 

Hi there, full disclosure, I'm a columnist and have strong opinions about saving mountain biking. Unfortunately, mountain bikers (some) are their own worst enemies. You know who I'm talking about, right?
Join the fight to keep trails open!

 

https://www.ocregister.com/2018/09/...n-heat-up-over-e-bike-riders-on-local-trails/
thoughts?

 

Ha... I'll grant that your idiot diagnosis is correct, but I'm not so sure about your cure... Maybe.

If you ever see a fat middle-aged guy on a Santa Cruz single speed (Highball or Chameleon) in O'Neill, feel free to say hello.

Thanks for stopping by.

 

I don't know that attacking various legal user groups is the best solution, but I suppose provocation sells copy, right?

E-bikes have motors and motorized vehicles are not allowed on most local human-powered or equestrian designated trails. Maybe spreading that message without calling out legal users would be helpful?

 

Dave, dashing off a few lines for a forum post, is, I hope, different than sitting down and preparing your article. However, if the tone of your article even vaguely resembles your post - what you intend to commit to printed page, I'm exceedingly worried. Your suggestions (in my opinion, unwarranted), simply give "the opposition" ammunition. Most of the trails are multi use, and for the most part open around the same time(s). If "we" (and by we, I mean you) suggest we're willing to have limited time on the trails, its a short step to removing us completely. The pen might well be mightier than the sword, but we don't want to cut our own throats. I hope you think long and hard about what you intend to write. I suspect the OC Register readership probably already have a distorted view of us.

 

Coolness, how about some suggestions that would help solve the problem of increasing usage and injuries? Thanks!

 

Welcome!
I’m all for saving mtn biking trails, and keeping ebikes on pavement

 

It sounds like the main problem , is similar to many other problems in SoCal... traffic, housing costs.. we are just way overpopulated.

Back to the survey, I would fully agree this is just them trying to see how much blowback they would get for ads and articles ebike related...